Spirituality and Sex
Alton: Hello guys welcome to tonight’s chat discussion with Reverend Neil Thomas of MCC.
Alton: Tonight’s topic is spirituality and sex can the 2 be in the same room.
Alton: So Reverend Neil how are you tonight?
Neil: I am doing fine, thanks Alton. Looking forward to chatting.
Alton: Great so let’s get started. Hey guys chime in if you have any questions or concerns and let’s get chatting.
Todd: What is MCC’s opinion about sexual expression as it relates to spirituality?
Alton: Some ground-rules let’s be considerate of others opinions and have fun.
Neil: Yes, we offer spiritual guidance, but unlike our heterosexual counterparts we don’t have a “one size fits all” answer! We are a diverse community.
Alton: How do you feel that our community as a whole could benefit from this integration of spirit and sexual self?
Todd: Also , how can we communicate this healthy approach to gay youth?
Neil: That’s a good question, Alton. I think that we could all benefit from believing in ourselves as good, wonderful, fabulous and beautiful people, made in the image of “God”. I do think that our self esteem would be much better and would help us in making decisions about who we share our intimate lives with.
Neil: Whether that be in a one night relationship or long term relationship.
Neil: We have a youth group at MCC and on Friday nights they do meet and talk about these issues. However, I think that these healthy attitudes toward self, sex and spirit must begin in our homes, schools, churches etc.
Neil: If we could integrate this into our “world” I believe that we would be much the better for it.
Alton: Do you see a connection between some of our ills in our community related to this lack of connection i.e. crystal, isolation, drugs etc. What ways have you seen people recover from these things?
Neil: Yes, I do see a connection and I mean this in no way a judgment thing.
Alton: What would you say about other types of connection like yoga or meditation?
Neil: I see that our self-esteem and self image has been so damaged by the negative messages that we constantly hear. This has led to many of us finding solace or even isolation in drugs/alcohol.
Neil: These things hide our inner feelings.
Todd: That could be very true.
Neil: Well I am not that old but whenever I meet new people in our community I think that I do a good job at meeting people. However, when they find out what I do for work, they freak out.
Alton: How so?
Neil: There prejudices are preconceived ideas about religion.
Neil: They are suddenly all focused on me- which is quite understandable as “we” are considered the enemy.
Alton: I would think that this would be a difficult barrier for some to overcome due to the messages they may have received from their religious upbringing.
Alton: Did you come out as Christian or a gay man first?
Todd: Many of us have had shocking experiences with the churches of our youth. I remember being about 15 when the topic of homosexuality was discussed in my church, and I was devastated by what I heard.
Neil: Absolutely and I quite understand…however, it makes it very difficult to help people overcome some of the barriers that need to be overcome to have both a healthy spirituality and a good sexuality.
Neil: I think I came out as a gay man first.
Alton: You mention healthy spirituality what would that look like?
Todd: Fortunately today, I’ve become a very spiritual person and appreciate what I consider the true teachings of Christ, which are in line with the principles you mentioned earlier.
Neil: Todd I am not surprised. Your experience unfortunately is not isolated.
Alton: Of course taking into account for some it is an individual process…
Neil: Actually Todd has probably already answered that question. A healthy spirituality is one that honors God, honors self and honors others.
Neil: You must have a connection with the inner self as well as the outer world. Of course a healthy sex life and sexuality is about the same principles.
Kevin: Did Jesus say he wanted us to have a healthy sex life?
Alton: Are you talking about the idea that one who honors themselves and others on a spiritual level is more apt to be as caring with their sexual partners?
Todd: As the senior pastor, do you find a demand to work with your church members to address sexual issues.
Neil: Ok …Kevin. Jesus talks about honoring your neighbor as yourself and in his life we see him exhibiting healthy attitudes towards women, men and many who live on the margins of society. He was not afraid of intimacy or crossing boundaries.
Neil: Todd, yes, I will talk openly about sexual issues. We have talked about sex addiction and the use of drugs/alcohol to block our feelings which makes healthy decisions about sex difficult.
Neil : I believe that Jesus calls us to be whole people in mind, body and spirit.
Todd: What I mean by my question is do your members turn to their church as we see in the heterosexual community. It seems that this would be a healthy place to turn for guidance. I think you already answered that question.
Neil: When I talk about spirituality I don’t just mean organized religion!!! I mean all types of spiritual acts that connect our “selves” together.
Alton: That’s awesome!!! So would you say that if one is to become aware of their inner feelings than they can get in touch with these inner feelings?
Neil: I think that we all need to find some “path” that works for us.
Todd: As a 12 stepper, I would absolutely agree. Drugs and alcohol can remove the insecurities and provide a false feeling of self esteem that eventually can turn against us.
Neil: Yes, I think that is the work of counselors who help us connect the inner.
Neil: Jesus said, love your neighbor as you love yourself. What he meant was that we had to learn to love ourselves first, before we can ever love our neighbor!!
Neil: We must do the inner work in order to build good relationships with one another.
Alton: Moving back to sexuality: Why do you think these 2 things are believed to be such polar opposites?
Todd: I love the attitude you have towards spirituality. Being able to find what works seems to have provided an answer for many of us.
Neil: I guess because many of us have been taught that sex is evil and should only be in the mission position for procreation, sex is evil and should only be used in relation to the one you love. See the stupidity of that!
Todd: Doesn’t make a lot of sense.
Neil: It doesn’t and has led us to the place we are now.
Alton: I’ve read that if one were to look at Gay Soul through a Jungian lens our children are children of creativity what are your thoughts on this?
Neil: Add homosexuality and we are really screwed… excuse the pun!
Todd: Do you feel that this attitude is beginning to change throughout our society?
Alton: Okay guys we are going to be closing up soon.
Neil: I believe that our next generation holds a vital role in the liberation of sexual orientation, gender identity and the need for a new look.
Alton: Wow that is mind-blowing.
Neil: Many of our youth are not seeking the labels that we have so often used, they tend to be bisexual.
Alton: Sometimes it is the labels that have separated us.
Todd: That is so true. The entire landscape has changed for younger generations.
Neil: Sharing intimacy with whom ever they feel.
Neil: This is going to present a huge problem for those who would force the ideology that heterosexuality is the norm!
Neil: Sex and sexuality carry a lot of power in our world and we are a part of the “queer” that is breaking down the stereotypical norms – it is our gift to the world….
Alton: For those that have any questions or comments please feel free to contact me at acarswel@lagaycenter.org or 323-860-7323.
Kevin: Thanks for the chat guys.
Alton: Reverend Neil do you have any events coming up that we should know about?
Neil: We worship every Sunday at 9 and 11am!!!
Neil: Godspell the concert is coming up Check out our website at www.mccla.org
Todd: Absolutely, do you feel this attitude is changing throughout the country, or is it somewhat distorted on the two coasts?
Alton: Great well with that we are going to close , I want to thank Reverend Neil for being our guest today.
Todd: Thank you.
Neil: It is changing around the world and the US is playing catch up!!
Alton: Thanks everyone who participated.
Neil: Thanks Alton for making this happen.
Very enriching discussion. Now I am clear that sexuality and spirituality can be reconciled. In fact you have impressed upon me that sexuality is also a form of spirituality that comes with responsibilities and first start with love for self. Not selfish love but love that begins within and flows without in the concern toward others. Thanks Pastor Neil, it is always a pleasure to hear from you. I quite admire your clear thinking. May God continue you in his service. Also thank you Alton for selecting a topic that is self-enhancing toward an individual psyche and perceptions.
Posted by: Reginald C | March 08, 2008 at 10:13 AM